blogHOUSTON.net forum

For discussion of items posted to blogHOUSTON.net

You are not logged in.

#1 2006-08-14 18:15:06

Anne
Moderator
Registered: 2004-09-08
Posts: 3,833

HPD looks to retirees for help

Retired police officers will soon be helping to alleviate HPD's manpower shortage:

The first retirees began training Monday at Houston’s downtown police headquarters.     

“We look at the background of the particular retired officer—how long they’ve been retired, what their particular service record is and the like—and find a job suitable for that officer,” said Houston Mayor Bill White.

11 News obtained an internal memo from Chief Harold Hurtt informing Mayor White that, by August 2, 199 retired officers had applied for part-time jobs and that 190 of them were retired HPD officers.

Nine were retirees from other law enforcement agencies.

The retirees will not work on the street like full-time officers.

But city officials said the part-timers will free up police for more active duty.

Jerry Defoor is president, Houston Police Retired Officers Association, “It’s probably going to be a majority of those folks will be in investigations.  That’s where there’s a tremendous amount of pressure on the department, because there’s not enough folks available to do the background of the cases that don’t have a lot of detail.”

[snip]

Some officers still on the force privately said they don’t like this idea and think Houston just needs to hire more full time cops.

I'm curious to know what our HPD folks think of this new program.



Link to post:  http://www.bloghouston.net/item/3934

Offline

#2 2006-08-17 09:31:13

TXSTEPHENS
Member
Registered: 2006-08-17
Posts: 26

Re: HPD looks to retirees for help

I think one of the biggest set back problems for HPD is that they're educational requirements are too high....40-60 college credit hours.There are alot of very intelligent people who can fill the positions needed that have never been to college just as in other corporate jobs and businesses.If the office positions needing vacancies filled to free up licensed trained persons then why can't the positions be filled without the college hours required set back?

Offline

#3 2006-08-17 10:20:25

rorschach
Member
From: Spring, Texas
Registered: 2005-01-05
Posts: 3,926
Website

Re: HPD looks to retirees for help

I have to wonder how that extra work will affect their pensions whaich is what started all this mess to begin with. i agree that putting seasoned PO's that can no longer hump it over fences and chase down thugs on desks working the investigation side while the current crop of desk flyers are put on the street is a very good idea. I was thinking about a similar idea some time back but i was unsure how it would affect the pensions.


http://redinktexas.blogspot.com/
"If ever a time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.”
Samuel Adams

Offline

#4 2006-08-17 10:31:05

Ubu Roi
Moderator
From: Houston
Registered: 2005-11-24
Posts: 1,766
Website

Re: HPD looks to retirees for help

I'm leery of lowering educational requirements; even when I graduated (and from a good school), I felt like there were things in college that any citizen should be exposed to before having the right to vote, let alone work certain jobs.  My major put me into contact with a lot of CJ people, and I'm sad to say that some (not all, so I'm not trying to make a general rule here) of them really needed the classroom time.  It wasn't so much their readin' and writin' but their outlook and critical thinking.

One question I have about this plan is how the officers who are getting put back onto the street feel about this.  To them, a desk job may have seemed like advancement; now they're getting tossed back onto the streets.  I know that here, when employees who have been promoted to other duties are forced back into first-line customer support by shortages, it causes resentment.  Just wondering if it's the same in HPD.  Barney, you got any input?


Those who do not know history are doomed to repeat it.  But they have no idea they're in a re-run.
The GOP has failed us for the last time.  It's time for a new way: the American Conservative Party
Proud non-winner of the Nobel Peace Prize (not even nominated!)

Offline

#5 2006-08-17 11:06:35

barney
Banned
Registered: 2006-01-18
Posts: 441

Re: HPD looks to retirees for help

Ubu Roi wrote:

Just wondering if it's the same in HPD.  Barney, you got any input?

I'm sittin' this one out!

Offline

#6 2006-08-17 11:25:28

boom34
Member
Registered: 2006-03-16
Posts: 47

Re: HPD looks to retirees for help

if those getting booted back to the streets are pissed, tough....most of them sought out desk positions, not as an advancement, but a lot are lazy and wanted dayshift and weekend offs....

those coming back still are getting there pensions, they are being paid $28/hr w/ no benefits, no vacation, no comp time accural

Offline

#7 2006-08-17 22:05:24

barney
Banned
Registered: 2006-01-18
Posts: 441

Re: HPD looks to retirees for help

boom34 wrote:

if those getting booted back to the streets are pissed, tough....most of them sought out desk positions, not as an advancement, but a lot are lazy and wanted dayshift and weekend offs....

those coming back still are getting there pensions, they are being paid $28/hr w/ no benefits, no vacation, no comp time accural

That is a pretty broad brush that you paint with.

Offline

#8 2006-08-18 00:39:23

boom34
Member
Registered: 2006-03-16
Posts: 47

Re: HPD looks to retirees for help

why is that....do you ride a desk?????

Offline

#9 2006-08-18 01:04:37

Ubu Roi
Moderator
From: Houston
Registered: 2005-11-24
Posts: 1,766
Website

Re: HPD looks to retirees for help

boom34 wrote:

if those getting booted back to the streets are pissed, tough....most of them sought out desk positions, not as an advancement, but a lot are lazy and wanted dayshift and weekend offs....

those coming back still are getting there pensions, they are being paid $28/hr w/ no benefits, no vacation, no comp time accural

Hey Boom, my cousin does shift work at a local refinery.  He's hoping to get a different position there; one that will put him on four tens instead of the constant rotation, which he finds very tiring.  It would also give him more time with his five kids.

Does that make him lazy too?


Those who do not know history are doomed to repeat it.  But they have no idea they're in a re-run.
The GOP has failed us for the last time.  It's time for a new way: the American Conservative Party
Proud non-winner of the Nobel Peace Prize (not even nominated!)

Offline

#10 2006-08-18 07:56:34

Ubu Roi
Moderator
From: Houston
Registered: 2005-11-24
Posts: 1,766
Website

Re: HPD looks to retirees for help

rorschach wrote:

I have to wonder how that extra work will affect their pensions whaich is what started all this mess to begin with.

Nothing.  Pensions were frozen when the employees entered DROP or retired, whichever happened first.  They can continue to collect their pension while working for the city, becoming "double-dippers."  There's a way to get back into the program, but it's difficult, and not worth it if the employee has already maxed benefits.

The dirty little secret: this "retiree re-hire" is NOTHING new.  I should have been making this point earlier -- the city does this sort of thing all the time.  Several years ago, during Brown's administration, his first PW&E manager was afraid Zindler or Dolecifino would find out about all the "double-dippers" and raise a stink about it.  He kicked all of them, which left some serious holes in many areas, including mine.  The practice was quietly re-instituted later, and two ex-managers are back as part-time help in my branch alone.   Maybe it wasn't done in HPD before now, but PW&E is constantly bringing back experienced personnel.  (It suggests a fundamental flaw in how institutional knowledge is passed along, but that's another story). 

So it's basically just a PR stunt.


Those who do not know history are doomed to repeat it.  But they have no idea they're in a re-run.
The GOP has failed us for the last time.  It's time for a new way: the American Conservative Party
Proud non-winner of the Nobel Peace Prize (not even nominated!)

Offline

#11 2006-08-18 08:19:55

barney
Banned
Registered: 2006-01-18
Posts: 441

Re: HPD looks to retirees for help

boom34 wrote:

why is that....do you ride a desk?????

Nice try. No, I dont.

Offline

#12 2006-08-18 10:05:08

boom34
Member
Registered: 2006-03-16
Posts: 47

Re: HPD looks to retirees for help

Ubu,

two different animals your are talking about......

you have to be w/in the dept... to observe many, many people who become officers who seek out or go straight to a desk or admin position......why become an officer if you don't want to put on a uniform......my position has always been officers should HAVE TO be in patrol for five years before they can promote or seek a desk position....we have many, many, many lazy officers who don't want to patrol

Offline

#13 2006-08-18 13:41:56

Ubu Roi
Moderator
From: Houston
Registered: 2005-11-24
Posts: 1,766
Website

Re: HPD looks to retirees for help

Should I take it then, that you are a member of the department?   Could be enlightening to have you and Barney arguing opposite sides of an issue.  (But respectfully, please guys!)

As for your question, shouldn't it also matter what people are good at? I can't give concrete examples, since I don't know the innards of HPD, but some people may be much better desk jockeys than patrolmen.  Not saying you're wrong, because I have always thought that the bosses/managers needed to spend a few years on the front lines.  But it sounds like you're saying that rookie officers can go straight to a desk job from the academy -- is that correct?


Those who do not know history are doomed to repeat it.  But they have no idea they're in a re-run.
The GOP has failed us for the last time.  It's time for a new way: the American Conservative Party
Proud non-winner of the Nobel Peace Prize (not even nominated!)

Offline

#14 2006-08-18 14:35:31

boom34
Member
Registered: 2006-03-16
Posts: 47

Re: HPD looks to retirees for help

Ubu Roi wrote:

But it sounds like you're saying that rookie officers can go straight to a desk job from the academy -- is that correct?

you are correct.......

there are many who have.....i know one who after getting off probation, went straight to working the desk at one station, then moved up in the admin office for a couple of years and then transferred to an admin spot in a division.....and this person fairly recently promoted.......never having patrol'd the streets other then their  training w/ someone

Offline

#15 2006-08-18 14:59:52

rorschach
Member
From: Spring, Texas
Registered: 2005-01-05
Posts: 3,926
Website

Re: HPD looks to retirees for help

I agree that some people make better chiefs and others better indians so to speak. That is the nature of human resources, some people are better suited to being administrators and others are not. That said, there is wisdom in the administrators spending time with the guys at the pointy end of the stick just to get an operational perspective of the job and to be able to better empathize with their employees. Far too many do not, in and out of government service.


http://redinktexas.blogspot.com/
"If ever a time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.”
Samuel Adams

Offline

#16 2006-08-22 21:57:27

TXSTEPHENS
Member
Registered: 2006-08-17
Posts: 26

Re: HPD looks to retirees for help

Pension is not affected as long as they are hired as a contract person meaning just that....they can be hired ,fired just like their contract says also with no city benefit participation and no Civil Service protection.I say that if an officer is out of shape and can't past the physical requirements as they did in the academy take them off the streets or keep them in shape.HPD officers have to qualify on the pistol range they should also on the physical aspects.Because if the officer can't chase and catch you there more likely to use a bullet to do so.So how many officers are out there that can only drive a police car or fit a desk than give foot chase pursuit to a crime suspect?You can't be a slob in the military so why out on our city streets;same war but different yard.

Offline

Board footer

Powered by FluxBB